November 3, 2008
Fraternal groups cut charitable giving amid sales slump
Organizations squeezed by smoking ban

CHARLESTON, W.Va. - In any other year, Nitro Moose Lodge Administrator Ray Kesling would have approved the $300 request from Nitro High School to buy T-shirts for cheerleaders to toss to fans during basketball games.

But Kesling turned down the request last week. The Moose doesn't have any money to donate to community groups and charities these days.

"We just don't have the funds to do it," Kesling said.

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    Posted By: carm1 (8:52pm 11-05-2008)
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    Does anyone have any idea how much this state is going to loose in taxes and revenue if the KCHD manages to take our civil rights away?
    As a smoker I already am discriminated against in my housing, job, insurance, and life insurance. I pay twice as much as a non smoker. I think if I pay dues to the Moose I should be able to smoke! Its private for a reason.

    Posted By: kreeker (2:09pm 11-04-2008)
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    breathe free make sure u vote for osama so more right will be taken away

    Posted By: yogipsk (1:25pm 11-04-2008)
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    At least in Iraq we could smoke, that is more freedom than Kanawha county. I have to go to the Putnam VFW because of the ban.

    Posted By: breathe free (12:49am 11-04-2008)
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    I don't think anyone goes to war for the right to publicly expose others to cancer causing toxins.

    Posted By: breathe free (12:41am 11-04-2008)
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    I don't think anyone goes to war for the right to publicly expose others to cancer causing toxins.

    Posted By: Earned_My_Degree (10:14am 11-04-2008)
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    That's America today - you go fight for freedom and when you come back home, they (mainly ones who did not serve) try to negate your freedoms and dictate to you. There is something seriously wrong in this country that surely needs fixed.

    Posted By: Traveling Nut (7:49am 11-04-2008)
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    Wake up, Ray Kesling! People are going elsewhere because they are FED with how the Nitro Moose is being run! Many of the bartenders (not all) are rude and only seem to cater to patrons who tip big. When I've been there, I noticed some patrons would get passed up and would be a while before they got waited on. Most of the bartending staff is relatives of the Ray Kesling. In fact, the new female bar manager is also a relative. In addition to this, the DJ seems to have control over the Moose. He plays music that is geared towards the younger crowd. Look around, DJ, it is mostly older patrons. Cater to them.

    I was there before the smoking ban and afterwards. Business was down long before the ban went into effect. Even when the Nitro Moose let folks smoke (going against the ban), business still was slow, so you can't blame it on the ban.

    Folks are going to other places because they are simply fed up with how the Nitro Moose is being run!

    Posted By: LSmith (10:12pm 11-03-2008)
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    To Kreeker: About the public housing projects, I agree that many of these people feel entitled to not work, next to nothing rent & then won't pay that until they're forced to. They believe the government has a duty to take care of them & after you try and help them stab you in the back. I have personal knowledge also that there are good hard working people in public housing projects & a lot of deadbeat dads won't take care of their kids. So it falls on the taxpayers. Public housing was never intended to be a permanent fix only a temporary one but the ones who abuse the system learn the system well, hide their incomes, know enough about the rules to quit work before the rent goes up and complain like hell about where they live. Their children go unsupervised while they're partying or worse and the cycle continues. The government is trying to make them pay up like all citizens and be responsible but there are too many bleeding hearts out there to stop the cycle.

    Posted By: kreeker (7:44pm 11-03-2008)
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    these public housing projects that we build for the lazy non working trash is a lot more dangerous to your health than smoking. you cant drive by the west side without crack dealers or prostitutes coming to your window from the projects.the tax paying people dont have a chance all the laws are made for them to suffer not the thugs and lazy people of kanawha county. just wait untill osama takes office you think its bad now get ready people cause half your payday will go to project trash

    Posted By: Katablog (5:13pm 11-03-2008)
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    It sounds to me like the Loyal Order of the Moose is using this excuse as a sounding board to drive their point home about smoking. Come on, folks! Pay for those shirts and get on with it!

    Posted By: pmasley (3:29pm 11-03-2008)
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    As a member of the Loyal Order Of Moose, I have seen firsth and what the ban has done to the Nitro, St,. Albans and Charleston Lodges. I just cannot understand though, how that it can be actually enforced. A Federal Suit from back in the 70's clearly states that just because the public is allowed into a building does not make that building public. The Loyal Order Of Moose is a private organization. The Health Department has no rights whatsoever to attempt to enforce any rules or regulations except for the food permit for the kitchen and dining room. What really puzzles me is the allowance for smoking at Bingo. Kids are at the Bingo games. This is statewide, not just at the Lodges. They are not allowed in the Social Quarters of the Social Quarters except on special occasions. The area organizations that depend on our donations are definately going to be hit and hit hard due to the drop in revenues. Just blame the Health Department for this, not us.

    Posted By: yogipsk (2:47pm 11-03-2008)
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    I agree that the ban is the problem. I was at the Nitro Moose last week and it was dead, I was downtown Friday night and it was dead.

    As far as the charitable requests go, I say send the requests to the Kanawha Charleston Health Department, maybe they will fund it. It is a sad day when the Moose has to cut donations, but I understand completely.

    Posted By: bartender (11:55am 11-03-2008)
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    Cher
    Yes, the state sets the payouts on the machines. It is done by a percentage basis. The payouts co-inside with the money taken in each machine.
    The payouts are lower because the machines are taking in less money.
    SAMom, I totally agree with you, people will not stay in an empty bar. It is not any fun.
    Once again, let me say would all the supporters of the smoking ban who drink and or gamble please patronize the bars where smoking is not being allowed. If you do not patronize bars, hush, you have nothing in this.
    As you can see by this article, bartenders and wait staff will be losing their jobs. Not only at the fraternal organizations, but also at other bars. Go out and find another job? Why should I have to? Ask almost anyone who works in a bar, they will almost all tell you how badly this has hurt their earning potential. Gas prices were high in June, it did not stop people from coming out. Come July 1, we all lost customers.
    Do not knock the fraternal lodges around either. They provide chari

    Posted By: Big Cher (10:20am 11-03-2008)
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    Yeah...blame everything on the smoking ban. At least your lungs are clearer and the air is cleaner. I hate cigarette smoke and I gamble. People don't realize the State is the one who sets the percentage on payouts. The machines aren't paying. Blame that on the State and not the smoking ban. I'm tired of playing machines when I can't get anything back.

    Posted By: mhensley (10:12am 11-03-2008)
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    I'm ready to start, jfaegre. First of all I truely beleive that the Kanawha-Charleston Health Board officials and the anti-smoking advocates are very wrong when they state that the sales will bounce back in time. The only way that will ever happen is to change this communist law, and the rise in gas prices has nothing to do with it. Yes I'm a smoker and was a member of the Nitro Moose since 1985 and when it came time to renew my membership this past September I didn't. And I also know a ton of members that haven't (smokers & nonsmokers) 2nd of all abount the state law and the bingo halls, this is just dening the nonsmokers law. It is not against the law to smoke around kids in a legal bingo hall but it is against the law to smoke where kids are not alowed. There is something very funny about this. 3rd of all why is it that we still can smoke at the dog track? There again kids are aloud?

    Posted By: Crash (10:04am 11-03-2008)
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    At the start of this smoking ban, the non-smokers ran their mouths on a daily basis about how they couldn't wait to be able to go out without the smokers. So where are they??? If so many of them wanted be to free from smoke they could be out there. But no, all they did was proclaim it was their right. Now look, how many businesses will close and donations are at an end. Come on, let's get this law reversed!

    Posted By: jfaegre (9:37am 11-03-2008)
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    Someone needs to start a petition and do something about this. The Eagles in Charleston has suffered tremendously. We are a family. If people don't want to be around smoke they need not join or come in. Set up a meeting someone and our folks will be there.

    Posted By: SAMom (8:30am 11-03-2008)
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    If you are a member of the Nitro Moose, you would have to know that Eyre's facts are probably pretty correct. All you have to do is walk in there.

    Posted By: True WV (7:38am 11-03-2008)
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    The legislature should pass laws and the Jones health department should enforce them. The health department is not elected so it is not responsible to the public, only to Dollar Danny.

    Posted By: bapaball (7:26am 11-03-2008)
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    Who ya gonna believe at the Gazette: Eyre who seems one-sided & doesn't seem to get his 'stories' completely factual, or Kabler who backs up his news articles with good investigation and facts??

    Posted By: dakman (6:50am 11-03-2008)
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    What a terrible situation we have!! What shall we do?? Fewer people are smoking and gambling! This must stop. We need more smokers and gamblers to make the world a better place. The Gazette should do something about it.

    Posted By: bartender (5:51am 11-03-2008)
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    Dear Vito,
    The Moose organization does have African American members. You should know what you are talking about before you speak.

    Posted By: Dog (1:08am 11-03-2008)
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    I think it is well past time for the HD to stop this nonsense! They calim it is the economy...balderdash!!!! It is no coincidence that it happened simultaneously with the smoking ban. Keep it up KCHD...soon they will be laying off and going bankrupt....LIKE YOU GIVE A RAT'S BEHIND!!!!!!!!!!

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